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| No. 20 | 
Nov 08, 2009, 02:10 PM
 Re: HR 3962 Has Passed the House. Originally Posted by leslie :-D  this is major stuff we're talking about here...
and whether i agree with their policy or not, i think it's safe to say that many of us are scared out of our wits re how/what its impact will be.
as with all other political concerns, i shall wait and see before pulling my hair out. 
leslie
We have more reason to fear the status quo.
 | | No. 23 |
Nov 08, 2009, 09:12 PM
Re: HR 3962 Has Passed the House. Originally Posted by cwazycwissyRN http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/us_health_care_overhaul Nancy does cause much humor, even on this evening. Go girl, compare this program with the other government ran programs that are in trillions of dollars of debt. Good point Nancy. I mean, really, at this point what is another trillion, well of course both of those programs cost 9 to 10 times their projections...hmmmmm so what's another several trillion dollars of debt added on really going to hurt? Entitilement programs....are driving this country into bankrupsy. Next on the adgenda, they have used to poor to obtain power in America, now they will use the planet earth to obtain power throught out the world. Maybe the congress will stop this crazyness, if not, well America, hand over your health and your wallets to uncle sam.
Data is data. Ezra Klein who is one of the preeminent policy wonks make the point that health care reform is entitlement reform.  It's a startling image. That orange line shooting into orbit? That's our projected deficit. That blue line levitating gently upward? That's our deficit if health costs grew more slowly. And those other lines sinking downward? They're our deficit if we had the per-person health costs of countries like France, Germany, and Canada. In all cases, Social Security spending remains unchanged. 
Health care reform flattens the budget curve to the desirable outcome seen in graphic 1. Government spending and Social Security, it says, will hold relatively constant in coming years. It's Medicare and Medicaid that chew up federal spending.
Links embedded.
| | No. 24 |
Nov 08, 2009, 09:51 PM
Re: HR 3962 Has Passed the House.
Good grief, what is really in this bill? I don't think anyone really knows. They can't even fiscally run Medicaid and Medicare, VA or Indian Health, and now, they are going to run everyone's (in 2013, after the election, of course) health care. Trillions of dollars in debt, printing more dollars and other countries bailing on the US dollar . . . all the graphs in the world won't change my mind about plain old COMMON SENSE.
One trillion = 1,000,000,000,000.00 A lot of zeroes. Hmmm, wonder what the interest on all this money costs us? Not to mention the decrease in tax revenue . . .
| | No. 25 |
Nov 08, 2009, 10:03 PM
Re: HR 3962 Has Passed the House. Originally Posted by Rebel Yell Good grief, what is really in this bill? .
And how did he get it? OBAMACARE ENDORSEMENTS: WHAT THE BRIBE WAS
By Dick Morris And Eileen McGann
11.7.2009
Published on TheHill.com November 6, 2009
As the suicidal Democratic congressmen proceed to rubber-stamp the Obama healthcare reform despite the drubbing their party took in the ‘09 elections, the president trotted out the endorsements of the AMA and the AARP to stimulate support. But these — and the other endorsements — his package has received are all bought and paid for.
Here are the deals:
* The American Medical Association (AMA) was facing a 21 percent cut in physicians’ reimbursements under the current law. Obama promised to kill the cut if they backed his bill. The cuts are the fruit of a law requiring annual 5-6 percent reductions in doctor reimbursements for treating Medicare patients. Bravely, each year Congress has rolled the cuts over, suspending them but not repealing them. So each year, the accumulated cuts threaten doctors. By now, they have risen to 21 percent. With this blackmail leverage, Obama compelled the AMA to support his bill…or else!
* The AARP got a financial windfall in return for its support of the healthcare bill. Over the past decade, the AARP has morphed from an advocacy group to an insurance company (through its subsidiary company). It is one of the main suppliers of Medi-gap insurance, a high-cost, privately purchased coverage that picks up where Medicare leaves off. But President Bush-43 passed the Medicare Advantage program, which offered a subsidized, lower-cost alternative to Medi-gap. Under Medicare Advantage, the elderly get all the extra coverage they need plus coordinated, well-managed care, usually by the same physician. So more than 10 million seniors went with Medicare Advantage, cutting into AARP Medi-gap revenues.
Presto! Obama solved their problem. He eliminates subsidies for Medicare Advantage. The elderly will have to pay more for coverage under Medigap, but the AARP — which supposedly represents them — will make more money. (If this galls you, join the American Seniors Association, the alternative group; contact sbarton@americanseniors.org This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it .)
* The drug industry backed ObamaCare and, in return, got a 10-year limit of $80 billion on cuts in prescription drug costs. (A drop in the bucket of their almost $3 trillion projected cost over the next decade.) They also got administration assurances that it will continue to bar lower-cost Canadian drugs from coming into the U.S. All it had to do was put its formidable advertising budget at the disposal of the administration.
* Insurance companies got access to 40 million potential new customers. But when the Senate Finance Committee lowered the fine that would be imposed on those who don’t buy insurance from $3,500 to $1,500, the insurance companies jumped ship and now oppose the bill, albeit for the worst of motives.
The only industry that refused to knuckle under was the medical device makers. They stood for principle and wouldn’t go along with Obama’s blackmail. So the Senate Finance Committee retaliated by imposing a tax on medical devices such as automated wheelchairs, pacemakers, arterial stents, prosthetic limbs, artificial knees and hips and other necessary accoutrements of healthcare. So these endorsements are not freely given, but bought and paid for by an administration that is intent on passing its program at any cost. | | No. 27 |
Nov 08, 2009, 10:13 PM
Updated
Nov 08, 2009 at 10:19 PM by Spidey's mom
Re: HR 3962 Has Passed the House.
Econ 101 by my favorite professor. http://jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell110309.php3 . . "There is a fundamental difference between reducing costs and simply shifting costs around, like a pea in a shell game at a carnival. Costs are not reduced simply because you pay less at a doctor's office and more in taxes — or more in insurance premiums, or more in higher prices for other goods and services that you buy, because the government has put the costs on businesses that pass those costs on to you. . . . http://jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell110409.php3 "Although it is cheaper to buy a pint of milk than to buy a quart of milk, nobody considers that to be lowering the price of milk. Although it is cheaper to buy a lower quality of all sorts of goods than to buy a higher quality, nobody thinks of that as lowering the price of either lower or higher quality goods.
Yet, when it comes to medical care, there seems to be remarkably little attention paid to questions of both quantity and quality, in the rush to "bring down the cost of medical care.". . . . .." http://jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell110509.php3 One of the strongest talking points of those who want a government-run medical care system is that we simply cannot afford the high and rising costs of medical care under the current system.
First of all, what we can afford has absolutely nothing to do with the cost of producing anything. We will either pay those costs or not get the benefits. Moreover, if we cannot afford the quantity and quality of medical care that we want now, the government has no miraculous way of enabling us to afford it in the future.
http://jewishworldreview.com/cols/sowell110609.php3
What is so wrong with the current medical system in the United States that we are being urged to rush headlong into a new government system that we are not even supposed to understand, because this legislation is to be rushed through Congress before even the Senators and Representatives have a chance to read it?
Among the things that people complain about under the present medical care system are the costs, insurance company bureaucrats' denials of reimbursements for some treatments and the free loaders at hospital emergency rooms whose costs have to be paid by others.
Will a government-run medical system make these things better or worse? This very basic question seldom seems to get asked, much less answered. | | No. 28 |
Nov 08, 2009, 10:26 PM
Updated
Nov 08, 2009 at 11:01 PM by herring_RN
Re: HR 3962 Has Passed the House. Originally Posted by Spidey's mom And how did he get it? OBAMACARE ENDORSEMENTS: WHAT THE BRIBE WAS By Dick Morris And Eileen McGann 11.7.2009 Published on TheHill.com November 6, 2009 As the suicidal Democratic congressmen proceed to rubber-stamp the Obama healthcare reform despite the drubbing their party took in the ‘09 elections, the president trotted out the endorsements of the AMA and the AARP to stimulate support. But these — and the other endorsements — his package has received are all bought and paid for. Here are the deals: * The American Medical Association (AMA) was facing a 21 percent cut in physicians’ reimbursements under the current law. Obama promised to kill the cut if they backed his bill. The cuts are the fruit of a law requiring annual 5-6 percent reductions in doctor reimbursements for treating Medicare patients. Bravely, each year Congress has rolled the cuts over, suspending them but not repealing them. So each year, the accumulated cuts threaten doctors. By now, they have risen to 21 percent. With this blackmail leverage, Obama compelled the AMA to support his bill…or else! * The AARP got a financial windfall in return for its support of the healthcare bill. Over the past decade, the AARP has morphed from an advocacy group to an insurance company (through its subsidiary company). It is one of the main suppliers of Medi-gap insurance, a high-cost, privately purchased coverage that picks up where Medicare leaves off. But President Bush-43 passed the Medicare Advantage program, which offered a subsidized, lower-cost alternative to Medi-gap. Under Medicare Advantage, the elderly get all the extra coverage they need plus coordinated, well-managed care, usually by the same physician. So more than 10 million seniors went with Medicare Advantage, cutting into AARP Medi-gap revenues. Presto! Obama solved their problem. He eliminates subsidies for Medicare Advantage. The elderly will have to pay more for coverage under Medigap, but the AARP — which supposedly represents them — will make more money. (If this galls you, join the American Seniors Association, the alternative group; contact sbarton@americanseniors.org This e-mail address is being protected from spambots. You need JavaScript enabled to view it .) * The drug industry backed ObamaCare and, in return, got a 10-year limit of $80 billion on cuts in prescription drug costs. (A drop in the bucket of their almost $3 trillion projected cost over the next decade.) They also got administration assurances that it will continue to bar lower-cost Canadian drugs from coming into the U.S. All it had to do was put its formidable advertising budget at the disposal of the administration. * Insurance companies got access to 40 million potential new customers. But when the Senate Finance Committee lowered the fine that would be imposed on those who don’t buy insurance from $3,500 to $1,500, the insurance companies jumped ship and now oppose the bill, albeit for the worst of motives. The only industry that refused to knuckle under was the medical device makers. They stood for principle and wouldn’t go along with Obama’s blackmail. So the Senate Finance Committee retaliated by imposing a tax on medical devices such as automated wheelchairs, pacemakers, arterial stents, prosthetic limbs, artificial knees and hips and other necessary accoutrements of healthcare. So these endorsements are not freely given, but bought and paid for by an administration that is intent on passing its program at any cost.
The CareAmerica Medicare Advantage may be responsible for my Daddy's death. His PSA kept rising. Every year for seven years it was higher than before.
I told him to see a urologist. His "Gatekeeper" physician did a needle biopsy and told him he didn't need a specialist. 1 1/2 years later he thought he had hurt his shoulder. It was bone mets, primary cancer was prostate.
He lived three more months.
October and most of November he was good with minimal pain meds. He still played in two bandsThen he couldn't feel his feet. He planned to play from a wheelchair but never did.
He died on Christmas Eve.
THis Medicare Advantage plan we taxpayers and individual Medicare beneficiaries paid for also paid "gatekeeper" physicians a bonus for not referring patients. I talked to his doctor after assuring him I was not planning a lawsuit. He said he had put in a request for authorization to see a urologist two years before. Because it was denied he told my Dad he didn't need to see one. These doctors signed a "gag clause' that they would not even tell the patient they could pay to see a specialist.
So my Daddy died. I was blessed to be able to care for him at home with amazing hospice nurses and caregivers help.
| | No. 29 |
Nov 08, 2009, 10:52 PM
Re: HR 3962 Has Passed the House. Originally Posted by herring_RN So my Daddy died. I was blessed to be able to care for him at home with amazing hospice nurses and caregivers help.
stories, such as yours, often leave me somber and quiet.
i'm so sorry herring, for all of it.
at least your daddy's music, is now being enjoyed everywhere. 
leslie
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