Did You Know?
allnurses is the largest community for nurses on the web. We now have 406,586 members! Join today to learn, network, laugh, and share with nurses.
| No. 50 | 
Nov 06, 2009, 06:14 PM
 Re: 12 dead, 31 injured in shooting at Fort Hood Texas Originally Posted by SharonH, RN  I bet if we listed the religions of all the spree killers the U.S. has seen in the past decade(too many to list), the majority of them would be Christian but then again, how would we know since the religion of the killers was brought up NONE of the time except this one-which tells me that they were not Muslim. (smile)
Well . . . . I have to disagree with the part about the "spree killers in the U.S." in the past decade being Christians and not having that discussed.
Tim McVeigh springs to mind . . . he was called a "right-wing Christian". I could bring up more . . but I'm having second thoughts about even writing this since it veers us away from what should be the subject.
Respectfully,
steph
 | | No. 52 |
Nov 06, 2009, 06:57 PM
Updated
Nov 06, 2009 at 07:49 PM by Kyrshamarks
Re: 12 dead, 31 injured in shooting at Fort Hood Texas Originally Posted by heron No one has claimed he had PTSD ... I certainly did not. I'm speculating on the psychological dynamics that might have triggered the atrocity in the first place.
I also think it's irresponsible to claim you know the whole story about why he did what he did. His religion most likely fed into his behavior in a big way ... but simple explanations usually don't cut it when it comes down to human behavior.
Just for the record, I am not now nor have I ever tried to justify these murders. Bottom line is, the dynamics don't make a difference regarding his guilt unless he's frankly psychotic ... and maybe not even then (I haven't made up my mind about that yet).
As far as the shooter is concerned, I tend to agree with Moogie ... there's a serious problem with psychological screening in the military. I think it's because of the split priorities: military vs therapeutic. It's worth some time to think about and discuss this stuff because those who persist in refusing to learn from history are doomed to repeat it.
As for the couple of comments re "If the shooter was Christian ...", all I can say is puhleeze ... this isn't about Christians. And the only ones making it about Christians at all are those who want to feel persecuted.
I agree with steph ... let's attend to the victims.
A: I never claimed to know the whole story
B: The military is there to train to kill There is not theraputic prority to the military. you know how many people are in the military and how many join every week? Literally millions of military members.
C: Based on history if the shooter shouted christain phrases there would people al over this decrying in the media, governmaent and even on here. We have seen it happen too many times in the past for anyone to try to deny it. The mans religious views guided what he did not any treatment (and apperantly from the news reports it was crappy treatment) that he was giving to soldiers.
D: As far as PTSD is comcerned, I really do have my serious doubts about it. And before I get flamed for this I have a brother that suffers from it supposedly, the VA has made him a drug addiuct who lives on valium. I ALSO have been in many intense combat situations for many years doing things that many would consider questionable, I have shot and killed the enemy, I have killed the enemy with my hands, I have seen many friends killed and wounded and disabled severlym, yet I have never had a nightmare from it, nor have any of my old buddies had noghtmares according to them.
| | No. 53 |
Nov 06, 2009, 07:00 PM
Re: 12 dead, 31 injured in shooting at Fort Hood Texas Originally Posted by heron Still, given that we've been on the receiving end of jihad for how many years by various Muslim groups who take exception to our influence/behavior in their part of the world, it's a reasonable question to ask.
I just don't think that it's the whole story.
Besides, framing anything as "religious" is a dead end ... no way to win that fight.
Fanaticism is, on the other hand, a whole other critter, characterized by a distinct lack of critical thinking and an overabundance of knee-jerk responses.
Meanwhile, how are the victims and their families? Are they getting what they need? Does anyone know?
I don't think it's unreasonable to ask either. After all when something like this happens, the natural inclination is to ask why although there will never be a satisfactory explanation for any of us.
BUT I always recoil when people start looking at characteristics of the individual who committed an act as if that alone was the reason whether it is religion, race, sexual orientation, etc. Once you start associating the act with those characteristics the next step is to marginalize others who share that trait, after all if you want to prevent this from happening again, then single out those people and so on and so forth.
That's why I brought up the other spree killers or mass murderers or whatever we're supposed to call them-and there have been plenty. If you want to prevent this type of thing from happening again it seems sorta pointless to get googly-eyed because Dr. Hasan was Muslim. What about the others?
| | No. 56 |
Nov 06, 2009, 10:57 PM
Re: 12 dead, 31 injured in shooting at Fort Hood Texas
His problem is that even he was psychiatrist he developed a mental disease. Whatever we want to add like predisposant factors are ok: stress, work profession, bla, bla...but...
MY question is... WHY for these type of people who work in "special" departments , units or why for people who work with people "special" are not special units for debriefing?
Debriefing is not used here?
From where I come, psychiatrist, psychologyst and people involved in special units, all of them they have devriefing times.... "SPECIAL" for psychiatrists and psychologists.... by 3/3 months (if I remember well and after each action) someone else asses them is they are still ok to work, or they need a "relache" time or to reconsider them work in another departments, till they will be able again to work ....
This man... was assesed before to happend what was happend? No one seen, nothing wrong with him.... he talked with someone.... or he was just throw out in the first line of military psych ... and "just to do you" without any backup or feedback.... finally he was knockout by stress and develop a mental disease... that is all. Not relevant that was muslim... just a coincidence!
| | No. 57 |
Nov 06, 2009, 11:38 PM
Re: 12 dead, 31 injured in shooting at Fort Hood Texas Originally Posted by zuzi His problem is that even he was psychiatrist he developed a mental disease. Whatever we want to add like predisposant factors are ok: stress, work profession, bla, bla...but...
MY question is... WHY for these type of people who work in "special" departments , units or why for people who work with people "special" are not special units for debriefing?
Debriefing is not used here?
From where I come, psychiatrist, psychologyst and people involved in special units, all of them they have devriefing times.... "SPECIAL" for psychiatrists and psychologists.... by 3/3 months (if I remember well and after each action) someone else asses them is they are still ok to work, or they need a "relache" time or to reconsider them work in another departments, till they will be able again to work ....
Oh, yes, those who work in particular departments are debriefed and given support as individuals and as units. There are special cares given to those who act in caregiving roles in the military such as medical and nursing personnel, chaplains, morticians. Originally Posted by zuzi This man... was assesed before to happend what was happend? No one seen, nothing wrong with him.... he talked with someone.... or he was just throw out in the first line of military psych ... and "just to do you" without any backup or feedback.... finally he was knockout by stress and develop a mental disease... that is all. Not relevant that was muslim... just a coincidence!
Zuzi, in an earlier post I speculated that the reason Major Hasan got through military screenings and was declared fit for deployment was that psychiatrists are so badly needed in the time of war, that someone chose to overlook Hasan's Hx of instability so he could deploy. Apparently what I said was right because that was mentioned this evening on NBC News. | | No. 58 |
Nov 07, 2009, 01:43 AM
Re: 12 dead, 31 injured in shooting at Fort Hood Texas Originally Posted by Kyrshamarks I ALSO have been in many intense combat situations for many years doing things that many would consider questionable, I have shot and killed the enemy, I have killed the enemy with my hands, I have seen many friends killed and wounded and disabled severlym, yet I have never had a nightmare from it, nor have any of my old buddies had noghtmares according to them.
Much respect to you. Unfortunately the first nursing job I ever had was training to be a nursing assistant in Windsor, CO where there were a lot of Vietnam vets who couldn't possibly have spent 30 years faking it. At the time it was utterly heartbreaking because it was the outbreak of Gulf War II.
I'm glad that you're OK and were lucky.
| | No. 59 |
Nov 07, 2009, 04:14 AM
Re: 12 dead, 31 injured in shooting at Fort Hood Texas Originally Posted by herring_RN My uncle told me he rarely spent a waking hour without thinking of when he looked into the mans eyes and killed him. Then when getting his tags saw a picture of him with (probably) his wife and little kids.
He said it wasn't nearly so bad with the machine guns from the beach.
He lived 62 years after that, was treated for "shell shock". My aunt told me for the first years he woke up having a nightmare several times a night.
He was a loving husband, father, uncle, grandfather, and great grandfather.
Had more friends than you could count and raised his boys to be Eagle Scouts.
And beat his swords into plowshares..
I have a friend whose father was a Normandy Beach vet. He never discussed this experience with his kids to the day he died....
I don't condone the shooting in the least. I do understand how the stress of living a life inconsistent with personal and emotional values can lead to a breakdown. War came home to ft hood one more time....
|
| 170 members
2,153 guests 2,323
|
World News & Politics